What A Long Strange Trip It’s Been
Proposition 8 is now a part of the California constitution!
That is probably the best news from an otherwise difficult election for conservatives and Republicans. In very large part, we Evangelicals must thank our Mormon cousins for that fact. They, along with our Catholic brethren, were better organized than us and that provided a base from which we could ALL work together to get this job done. What more, as we have chronicled here, Mormons took the brunt of the abuse, derision, and even threats of physical harm that came with this effort.
And like us, they have given thanks to the Almighty that is ultimately in control, even if their understanding of that Almighty is a bit diffrent than ours.
I cannot help but wonder how much more thankful we ALL might be today if we had been more willing to embrace these religious cousins a few months ago – but alas, politics is always about governing today and looking forward to the next election.
In the battle for the family, however, traditional Christians have no better friends than the Mormon faithful. It would be wrong if that support were taken for granted. We are intolerant of the false attacks on Mormon faith and family. We stand with our Mormon friends in their right to express their views on the public square. We celebrate the areas, such as family values, where we agree.
A heart felt thank you may not win points from other friends who demand one hundred percent agreement from their allies, but it is the decent and proper thing to do.
Thank you to our Mormon friends and allies!
Hard to do better than that. The “Ruth Youth” ministry proclaimed yesterday “International Mormon Appreciation Day.” Very appropriate, yet still inadequate.
In addition to our thanks, Mormons deserve our protection. They have been oppressed in ways during the Prop 8 campaign that this nation has not seen since the 1960′s and the civil rights movement. The rhetoric has been deplorable, but moreover. we have seen instances of vandalism, property destruction, and some leaders in the fight currently find themselves with armed protection because of the threats made against them and their families.
Our nation will not and cannot tolerate this sort of behavior – it is incumbent on all of us to stand against it, and the best way to do that is to stand between the Mormons and the forces that would perpetrate such evil.
Now I am sure the Mormons can, and probably want, to take care of themselves, but as a Christian, it is my duty to protect the innocent and free the oppressed. To turn a blind eye in this circumstance is not only ungracious, it is simply unChristian.
Make all the theological distinctions you want, but in the political arena we are yoked with the Mormons (he said borrowing some religious imagery) and it is darn well time we started acting like it.
Absolutely, positively thank the Mormons – but don’t stop there. Stand up and be counted against the evil that has been perpetrated towards them in this campaign.
As Christians we can do no less.
Posted in Candidate Qualifications, Doctrinal Obedience, News Media Bias, Religious Bigotry, Understanding Religion | 19 Comments » | 
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stefanie on 06 Nov 2008 at 12:39 pm #
Thanks for all of your hard work with Lowell on behalf of Mitt Romney & Prop 8. I sure would like it if you would refer to us as your Mormon Brothers instead of Mormon Cousins. We consider you our Brother.
nd_kid on 06 Nov 2008 at 3:02 pm #
Hey John,
I don’t know where you’re getting your optimism! The Yes on 8 campaign spent $35 Million, countless man-hours, and still BARELY won (by 2%!). We had to pull out our worst scare tactics to get people interested in our position on the issue (The kids! The kids!). Given the fact that a similar vote passed by 61% in 2000, it is obvious that the Yes on 8 camp is losing support at an alarming rate! I believe that eventually this battle will go the way of previous civil rights challenges… You do know that they’ve been allowing interracial marriage in California since 1948! And not only that, but Mormons let Africans be preists starting in 1978! Can you believe it? We’re bound to lose this one too. 5 million Californians are now angry at the Mormons and Evangelicals, and I believe that time is on their side. Maybe we should just go back to Utah where we can be ourselves.
Jebediah Malachi
kgbudge on 06 Nov 2008 at 4:37 pm #
It appears that the Mormon temple in Los Angeles was forced to close this evening because of protests over the Church’s support for Proposition 8. I don’t have a lot of details yet.
Monica H on 06 Nov 2008 at 9:00 pm #
As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormon), I was so touched by the content of this post. My husband is from California, and we put in many hours volunteering on behalf of Proposition 8. We believe so strongly in defending marriage, and it is so good to know that our brothers in other religions feel the same way. Thank you all for everything that you have done on behalf of Prop 8, and thank you for the feelings of fellowship extended in this posting! I hope that we can continue to work together to protect our religious freedom and the institution of marriage.
Josh M on 06 Nov 2008 at 9:18 pm #
What a great post! I’m a Mormon and I wish we could work together with other Christians more often (yes, I know that many don’t consider us Christians, but hey, we’re doing our best). I know we have some different beliefs, but with all the opposition Christians face today, I think we should focus on our similarities. I also consider you a brother, John. I have to add that, although I consider nd_kid’s post to be a troll, I must agree that if trends continue, we will lose this battle in California. My belief is that as long as the liberal public education system has a monopoly on our children’s education, each generation of voters will be more and more liberal. The long-term solution to the problem? School vouchers.
joyjohnson on 07 Nov 2008 at 1:00 pm #
John, thank you for that post, well said and we appreciate the support of our fellow Christians. I am a Mormon and all of the attacks against my religion have deeply upset me. I was one of those people who attacked others for their righteous beliefs, then as a teen having hit a “rock bottom” my religion saved my life. My parents use to wonder if I would make it to my 18th birthday. I have so much respect now for Christians and how much scrutiny we all receive on a day to day basis from the media and all around us. I read my scriptures daily and am always amazed at the hate and anger from those apposing God and those who believe in him. These last few weeks I have related so much to those persecuted in the scripture stories and am sad for those attacking Christianity.
I do not understand the amount of hate others have for us and their very inappropriate, childish and evil ways of showing they disagree with us. I have lost friends over Proposition 8 and my stand on it. They were angry I was voting Yes. What happened to freedom to vote how we see fit? What happened to freedom of choosing for ourselves?
What happened to normal, healthy debates with those in disagreement? What if we were to protest and riot at a gay convention, why is it ok for those protesting at the LA Mormon Temple? Notice the media turns a blind eye to these things.
If one good thing came from this I feel it is gaining brothers and sisters from other religions and feeling the love and support from other Christians around the world. My beliefs have been strengthened even more by all of the attacks and slander from the media.
Just this one positive post has swelled my heart and boosted my moral after hundreds of negative posts and emails.
Thank you so much, John. You are making a difference.
jen03002 on 07 Nov 2008 at 1:08 pm #
What a great article John. Thank you so much! As a Mormon, when I saw all the things that were being said about our church I was shocked! I thought to myself, this is horrible! Mormons are getting all the credit for this great work when really there were so many other good Christians who should be recognized for their hard work as well.
Okay, maybe there’s a bit of sarcasm in that remark but it’s true. We were all in this one together, and as many have been saying, I hope this unity will continue. This is exactly what Satan wants, he wants us to divide and look at all our differences knowing fully well that when we all come together we are strong!
Thank you all my Christian brothers and sisters!
bljlmax on 09 Nov 2008 at 9:15 am #
Thank you for an informative blog. The internet has come along at a great time. One would search in vain for this type of information from the main stream media. All they have to sell is credibility, and they’ve lost it completely.
Unfortunately, I think the battle for traditional family/marriage has just begun, but it must continue to be won for the sake of our families and society.
Thanks to so many for the very strong successful efforts on Prop. 8.
kkiffe on 12 Nov 2008 at 6:03 am #
From a convert to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Thank you. Thank you! Thank you!!
It’s so sad that those in opposition to “traditional” marriage don’t realize that society will crumble if marriage is redefined. How do you help someone that thinks you mean to undermine them? All we can do is sincerely pray for them, forgive them, and keep doing what we know is right.
We also need to realize that not all gay people “hate” Christians. The violence was committed by a few – there are always a “few” in any organization, religion, life style, etc. – however, it is very difficult to forgive the media
.
Seriously, I even pray for individuals in the media to speak the truth….
Our other opposition/challenge that needs our constant attention and energy is the incorrect view on abortion. I can’t believe how sick our society really was and still is (Infanticide – I just barely learned of this, Partial Birth Abortion – unbelievable!). I’m trying to learn how to best make a difference. If anyone has some good ideas, please post!!!
lostsociety on 12 Nov 2008 at 7:32 am #
I’m so relieved that the rights of the homosexuals have been taken away again. They were actually marrying each other. Can you believe it??? Thanks to great men like John and countless others in the campaign, we got these liberals to stop destroying our society. We were a heart beat away from being just like Canada where they allow their gays to marry and look at how destructive its been for them. We really missed a bullet thanks to God. And then there are those gays that think they have God on their side. Since when did God allow Gay people to heaven? They are all evil – evil to the core and hell and damnation upon them all. Just like the bible says.
We should vote to take away their civil unions next. Lets start that campaign immediately. Lets take away their right to hold jobs. Lets make life so miserable for them, that it will be undeniable that they are angels of Satan. Its disgusting how these gays have children and love them and pretend they are a loving family. Sick! Sick! Sick!!! We must continue forward and remove them from our society. They are the virus, we are the antidote.
John Schroeder on 12 Nov 2008 at 7:38 am #
Ah, sarcasm.
No one here has ever condemned a homosexual to hell nor referred to homosexuals as “angels of hell.” It is quite possible to oppose same sex marriage and not think those things.
The only evil we have decried here is the tactics of physical intimidation and property destruction that have come in the wake of the election results. Those things are evil from heterosexuals, homosexuals, blacks, whites, and oh by the way, Martians.
lostsociety on 12 Nov 2008 at 8:05 am #
So John, if they could be going to heaven, does that mean they are our equal in creation? Why shouldn’t we oppress them if we believe they can’t enter heaven? Lets teach them a lesson. Unless you are saying that there are multiple levels of heaven….are you saying you believe Mormon theology of multiple levels of heaven? We need to separate these people from us John. Marriage should still exclude blacks and minorities in general just like back in the sixties when the term Marriage was still pure and before it got redefined by liberals in the Churches and in our governments. Marriage should be defined as between one white Heterosexual man (such as yourself) and one white woman. Period!
John Schroeder on 12 Nov 2008 at 9:44 am #
This blog does not engage in discussions of theology, nor does it make judgments about who will and will not end up in heaven. Those are issues for you to take up with your church.
My comment was designed purely to clarify what had and had not been said in this post or on this blog. This post was written purely in response to the tactics used by those opposed to the passage of Proposition 8.
Billie on 14 Nov 2008 at 2:52 am #
As one small voice amongst the many, I thank you, John, and also Mark Reynolds for extending the hand of brotherhood and for bringing to the fore that we who love the traditions and values this country was built on must stand together now and in the times ahead. It may be a long hard fight over this and also over other issues in the near future. With Christmas coming up, the atheists have started their annual Christian bashing. They have a right to say their piece as do others who disagree with us, but I know that if we who are like minded will continue to stand together we can make the difference. May God bless America and guide us to a safe harbor.
stm on 15 Nov 2008 at 8:37 am #
As a lifelong Catholic I am glad to see there are still people in this country that are willing to stand up for what is right and moral. They are being persecuted for doing so. Mormons and Catholics alike, take solice in the fact that Christians have been persecuted throughout history for their beliefs, but in the end the reward of Eternal Life will be theirs and their persecutors will shall be condemned to hell for their own eternity.
lostsociety on 18 Nov 2008 at 10:43 am #
Yeah stm. You said it. Condemn them to hell. And lets not confuse civil rights with morality here. Standing up for a civil right in this case is the same as persecuting God himself. Condemn them to hell I say. All Gays and those who fight for their rights that we all find immoral.
lostsociety on 18 Nov 2008 at 10:44 am #
???What were those tactics on the opposed side? Truth? Rights guaranteed by the constitution of California for all men? Refuting false claims that the Yes side used to frighten its congregations? Trying to convince people that Prop 8 had no wording whatsoever regarding education in schools despite proponents publishing otherwise? Trying to convince people that every single case cited on the Yes side were from out of state and had no application whatsoever in regard to Prop 8 or to California’s own laws? Just what sort of tactics are you referring to on the No side? The tactics were to use the truth to get people to realize Prop 8 was not an amendment – it was a revision to the constitution. But just like our Bush led government, fear is the ultimate persuader and works miracles to convince people – even when that fear is based on mistruths. Yes on 8 should be ashamed of themselves. Regardless of the cause, if you can’t use the truth as an end to the means, it should tell people something about the cause itself.
The right to petition and to congregate still stands in the constitution until that gets taken away from gays as well. Destruction of property doesn’t fit with 99.9% of the people who are opposed to this vote. Addressing the few does not correctly label the whole as KKIFE’s earlier post properly distinguishes.
But if a vote were available to remove YOUR own right to marry to be unconstitutional – what would we expect to see in the aftermath? Are these protests not to be expected? Does anyone’s history book show the act of removing civil rights from any minority group without immediate reaction and back lash? How could anyone possibly expect a docile response?
By and large the responses I’ve witnessed have been peaceful, civil and have not involved any destruction of property and I’ve been to several very large ones.
I do however want to commend you for accepting my posts. My earlier post was not made up. It was taken from the words that a “Christian” man told me just two years ago. These beliefs are not from my own head. I accept not all Christians feel the same, however, I want to know why this act to vote Yes actually made sense to them. I’ve listened to every argument. I’ve read and studied every piece of information I could get my hands on from the Yes campaign. I can refute every article, piece of evidence, and illogical conclusion that I’ve read or heard so far on the Yes side. I’ve yet to find evidence that during the few short months Gays were allowed to marry (interpreted by a largely conservative Republican Supreme Court ruling), how did this invalidate a straight couple’s marriage and family? How did it corrupt their society? How did it cause Gays and Lesbians to come crashing in their churches demanding to be married? How did it require their children be taught Homosexuality in schools that wasn’t already in place before gays were given the right to marry? Prop 8 did nothing to address these concerns aside from remove the right to civil marriage from a minority group.
We undoubtedly have differing opinions about reasons children deserve to learn about the civics in their society. I feel a child has a right to know their surroundings. They have a right to be educated about their society. They also have a right to have moral teachings from their parents and churches in this regard. But don’t children have the right to know there is a place for them in this world regardless of race, gender, religion, and sexual identity? Or would parents rather see their child commit suicide when they fail to identify themselves as heterosexuals. This is happening today and has happened countless times in the past. This does not go away. Can’t we teach morals to children regardless of what sexual orientation that may feel convicted to live? Obviously most people who are gay did not become gay because they were taught about it in schools. In fact, they were taught the opposite. Many spend years trying to convert to Heterosexuality with complete failure.
I deeply respect that you were willing to listen to another side and post it for others to read. It was my experience that most on the Yes side that I encountered, were not willing to offer the same consideration and would only listen to what their church had to say.
liveslaughsloves on 18 Nov 2008 at 5:25 pm #
I’m so amazed at how quickly people jump to conclusions. Just because a person feels we need to have laws restricting who may marry, does not mean that we are condemning anyone to hell.
What I see is that a few people want to define marriage for a whole society. I could also use alarmist language just as lostsociety chose to use. For example: If we allow marriage, in this society to be defined to be other than just between one man and one woman, it could eventually be defined as ok for a man and a child whose parents give permission to marry, or 3 or four ladies, or 2 men and 2 women, or one large group of people. Why not? It would be cheaper than forming a corporation and if these people want to join together, who has the right to stop them? We do! As a majority, we do have that right.
Regardless of this argument, the fact is, the majority of active voters spoke and they have a right to do so without persecution. I didn’t get to vote and didn’t have any influence, but I do believe that in this predominantly Christian society, we ought to be able to define marriage as between one man and woman.
I don’t have anything against some other form of civil union to protect the civil rights of those of the same gender who wish to be united, but I don’t feel that marriage and family will be strengthened by same sex marriage. I believe I have a right to express that view. My fear is that if I don’t speak up now, later, I will be vilified and prosecuted by the law under hate crimes legislation when I do express that view.
jonpinney on 10 Dec 2008 at 9:57 pm #
lostsociety…
if you take religion out of marriage and look at it purely from a legal standpoint, what do you have?
a contract.
the contract defines the relationship between three distinct entities (husband, wife, government) and requires the participation of all three entities to complete the contract and be legally binding. the marriage contract holds sway over the previously mentioned entities (husband, wife, government) and a fourth distinct entity (children).
if you look at same-sex marriage from a purely legal standpoint, it looks slightly different:
it would still be a contract.
the contract would require the participation of only two distinct entities (husband, government or wife, government… assuming you keep the same nomenclature) and would have no sway over children (since the relationship cannot produce them; adoption is a separate contract).
or you could have it be three distinct entities (party a, party b, government)
either way, a marriage contract and a same-sex marriage contract are not the same thing. the only way you can make them the same is by changing the original marriage contract. the only problem with this is that there are millions of californians who are legally bound with the state in the original contract. by changing the original contract the state is breaking the contract. as a citizen of the state of california, it is the right of every married person to have the state uphold its end of the contract.
you talk about equal rights.
the rights of every married person are being trampled, and you don’t care.
you say the gays do not have equal rights.
that is false. any gay man or woman is able to enter into the contract of marriage (husband, wife, government) as long as they are of legal age or receive permission to do so (if they are not of legal age).
the same-sex marriage contract already exists. it is called “civil union”.