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	<title>Comments on: They Are Back And It Is Ugly</title>
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	<description>&#34;Religion, Politics, the Presidency: Commentary by a Mormon, an Evangelical, and an Orthodox Christian&#34;</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 14:35:26 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Boise Leon</title>
		<link>http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/comment-page-1/#comment-12511</link>
		<dc:creator>Boise Leon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 19:52:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/#comment-12511</guid>
		<description>Veepgate may be related to other incidents to block Mitt Romney from getting into power. I have no doubt the signers of the warning letter to McCain have been used, especially Paul Weyrich who seems to be very befuddled at this time. The signers of that letter did not come up with the plans or the funds to mount such a campaign. The charges were so outlandish, the reported $2.5 million standing behind the effort has evaporated due to the rush of free publicity. Because of the nature of PACs, we may never know whose plan it was, but I would suspect Soros is in there somewhere. The charges are blatantly false, but I don’t suppose anyone is afraid of being judged for false witness. It can all be blamed on the other guys who signed up.

For the past two years I have been trying to figure out who is behind what. As soon as word started getting around about the possibility of Mitt running for president I set a Google search subscription to gather all the information in the media. It wasn’t long before I saw an item about the polygamous group in the Shortcreek area of southern Utah. A man named Warren Jeffs who was the leader of the polygamous sect had been put on the FBI Ten Most Wanted list. His crime was listed as: Evading arrest. His crime in Utah was mismanagement of trust funds regarding property donated by church members for communal use. Other people on the FBI list were Osama bin Laden, some terrorists, a convicted murderer and some bank robbers, all of which seemed to be dangerous men and threats to America. The wanted poster did not list any crimes other than evading arrest. Arizona had tried to convict several members of the community but could not complete a trial because of lack of witnesses. Some of the men pleaded to lesser bogus charges to avoid years of jail time awaiting trial. Habeas Corpus did not seem to apply in Arizona or Utah and so people could be held indefinitely while the State tried to build a case.

Shortly after the first Most Wanted poster came out additional news release came out listing a $50,000 reward for the “capture” of Warren Jeffs. A short time later another press release listed an additional $50,000 reward making a total of $100,000. Now, Mr. Jeffs is not a tough guy who packs a weapon. He is a very frail 50 year old man who speaks very softly and with a slow halting meter. He was loved by his followers and virtually hated by everyone else for his religious practices of arranging marriages, expelling unruly boys and dissolution of families to maintain control over his flock of believers.

Fifty five years ago the State of Arizona created a disaster in a community called Shortcreek, Arizona. Although in Arizona, Shortcreek has no roads connecting it to Arizona, only to Utah and Nevada. Residents in Shortcreek believed they had no connection to the United States and they had found a place of refuge to practice their faith. The Arizona National Guard was employed to route every citizen including children and transport them through Utah, Nevada and Arizona hundreds of miles into the State or Arizona and began to forcibly separate children from their mothers and fathers. News teams from major magazines and news papers did picture stories of crying children and mothers and incensed the American population to object the savage treatment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_Creek_Raid

Arizona was so embarrassed by the incident that they never attempted to interfere with the community for over 50 years. By 2006 the Attorney Generals of the State of Utah and Arizona received a grant from the US Dept. of Justice to create a program of cooperation between the states to deal with victims of violence and child abuse in polygamous communities. They created a document called The Primer outlining the culture of the various communities and listing any criminal codes in each state that might be helpful to control abuses. 
 
http://www.attorneygeneral.utah.gov/polygamy/The_Primer.pdf

It is a well known fact that neither attorney general wanted to create a crisis in their state opposing polygamy and that the focus was on violence against women and children.

Within about 6 weeks a Nevada Patrolman stopped a vehicle with temporary  plates to check registration. Warren Jeffs was recognized as one of the occupants and was arrested on the strength of the FBI most wanted poster. He was held in Nevada only to discover that Arizona did not have a case open to prosecute Jeffs in a timely manner and Utah did not have anything but a civil suite that would warrant a no bail cause. There existed on the books a new statute that had never been brought to court called “Rape by accomplice”. Based on that, Jeffs was first transferred to Utah under heavy armed guard and incarcerated in solitary confinement and held without bail for 16 months in a jail called Purgatory near Hurricane, Utah. During that time he collapsed and had to be treated in a hospital from fasting and ulcerated knees from praying. He seemed to suffer a mental breakdown and tried unsuccessfully to do an end run on his attorney to deliver a message to the judge that he was no longer the leader of his church and he had never had authority to hold his position in the church. In a bizarre side line to the case a reporter who snapped a picture of the note from across the court was prosecuted for the action.

Back to what puzzles me. I contacted the Arizona prosecuting investigator about the details of the FBI action. He could not explain it. He had asked his superiors about that and there is no clue to how he got on the Ten Most Wanted list or who put up the two rewards. Let us try to connect the dots. In June, 2006, Mitt had announced his intention to run for POTUS. So, had John McCain. Mark Shurtleff, Utah Attorney General and Terry Goddard, Arizona Attorney General had joined hands taking years in the making to create a policy to avoid incidents along polygamy lines that would compare with the mistakes made in 1953. Utah supported Mitt Romney by 90% and Mark Shurtleff, AG of Utah, supported McCain. Any press releases by Mitt Romney were matched by press releases regarding Jeffs, even when there was no event. Google activity for Mitt Romney listed Provo, UT, Boise, ID and Malmo, Sweden as the three highest request areas. Utah successfully convicted Jeffs (on appeal) but did not inform the jury that the main witness (victim) had a $10 million dollar lawsuit against the FLDS trust. Arizona has taken custody of Jeffs and has not been able to get cooperation from their key witnesses and have dropped those cases.

The publicity cow has almost run dry and there is no more news about Jeffs. But, wait!  A sheriff in El Dorado, Texas has taken over 200 prisoners in an FLDS compound. The first children were bussed away from the compound in Baptist Sunday School busses. A judge issued a warrant to cross the Holy of Holy threshold of an FLDS temple in search for a 16 year old girl who placed a 911 call accusing a 50 year old man under probation in Arizona of marrying and impregnating her. The man has been contacted and says he does not know the girl. Yes, and 200 people have been arrested in Texas. For a while this situation seemed like it would rival the Waco debacle, but the FLDS in El Dorado do not seem to be suicidal or heavily armed, in fact they are probably having a picnic being martyrs and having their civil rights trampled on. El Dorado will not be Waco, but it will be the next publicity cow to replace Jeffs in Purgatory Prison.

Meanwhile there are a bunch of “social conservatives” trying to ruin the good name of 
Mitt Romney and not caring where exactly the money came from. Considering that McCain will suffer collateral damage, it is most likely from the liberal left. What Republican can profit from such a dumb move? Certainly Mike Huckabee is not involved.

So, where is the Pulitzer Prize  winning Washington Post when we need some investigative reporting? (Whisper): Follow the money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Veepgate may be related to other incidents to block Mitt Romney from getting into power. I have no doubt the signers of the warning letter to McCain have been used, especially Paul Weyrich who seems to be very befuddled at this time. The signers of that letter did not come up with the plans or the funds to mount such a campaign. The charges were so outlandish, the reported $2.5 million standing behind the effort has evaporated due to the rush of free publicity. Because of the nature of PACs, we may never know whose plan it was, but I would suspect Soros is in there somewhere. The charges are blatantly false, but I don’t suppose anyone is afraid of being judged for false witness. It can all be blamed on the other guys who signed up.</p>
<p>For the past two years I have been trying to figure out who is behind what. As soon as word started getting around about the possibility of Mitt running for president I set a Google search subscription to gather all the information in the media. It wasn’t long before I saw an item about the polygamous group in the Shortcreek area of southern Utah. A man named Warren Jeffs who was the leader of the polygamous sect had been put on the FBI Ten Most Wanted list. His crime was listed as: Evading arrest. His crime in Utah was mismanagement of trust funds regarding property donated by church members for communal use. Other people on the FBI list were Osama bin Laden, some terrorists, a convicted murderer and some bank robbers, all of which seemed to be dangerous men and threats to America. The wanted poster did not list any crimes other than evading arrest. Arizona had tried to convict several members of the community but could not complete a trial because of lack of witnesses. Some of the men pleaded to lesser bogus charges to avoid years of jail time awaiting trial. Habeas Corpus did not seem to apply in Arizona or Utah and so people could be held indefinitely while the State tried to build a case.</p>
<p>Shortly after the first Most Wanted poster came out additional news release came out listing a $50,000 reward for the “capture” of Warren Jeffs. A short time later another press release listed an additional $50,000 reward making a total of $100,000. Now, Mr. Jeffs is not a tough guy who packs a weapon. He is a very frail 50 year old man who speaks very softly and with a slow halting meter. He was loved by his followers and virtually hated by everyone else for his religious practices of arranging marriages, expelling unruly boys and dissolution of families to maintain control over his flock of believers.</p>
<p>Fifty five years ago the State of Arizona created a disaster in a community called Shortcreek, Arizona. Although in Arizona, Shortcreek has no roads connecting it to Arizona, only to Utah and Nevada. Residents in Shortcreek believed they had no connection to the United States and they had found a place of refuge to practice their faith. The Arizona National Guard was employed to route every citizen including children and transport them through Utah, Nevada and Arizona hundreds of miles into the State or Arizona and began to forcibly separate children from their mothers and fathers. News teams from major magazines and news papers did picture stories of crying children and mothers and incensed the American population to object the savage treatment.</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_Creek_Raid" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_Creek_Raid</a></p>
<p>Arizona was so embarrassed by the incident that they never attempted to interfere with the community for over 50 years. By 2006 the Attorney Generals of the State of Utah and Arizona received a grant from the US Dept. of Justice to create a program of cooperation between the states to deal with victims of violence and child abuse in polygamous communities. They created a document called The Primer outlining the culture of the various communities and listing any criminal codes in each state that might be helpful to control abuses. </p>
<p><a href="http://www.attorneygeneral.utah.gov/polygamy/The_Primer.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.attorneygeneral.utah.gov/polygamy/The_Primer.pdf</a></p>
<p>It is a well known fact that neither attorney general wanted to create a crisis in their state opposing polygamy and that the focus was on violence against women and children.</p>
<p>Within about 6 weeks a Nevada Patrolman stopped a vehicle with temporary  plates to check registration. Warren Jeffs was recognized as one of the occupants and was arrested on the strength of the FBI most wanted poster. He was held in Nevada only to discover that Arizona did not have a case open to prosecute Jeffs in a timely manner and Utah did not have anything but a civil suite that would warrant a no bail cause. There existed on the books a new statute that had never been brought to court called “Rape by accomplice”. Based on that, Jeffs was first transferred to Utah under heavy armed guard and incarcerated in solitary confinement and held without bail for 16 months in a jail called Purgatory near Hurricane, Utah. During that time he collapsed and had to be treated in a hospital from fasting and ulcerated knees from praying. He seemed to suffer a mental breakdown and tried unsuccessfully to do an end run on his attorney to deliver a message to the judge that he was no longer the leader of his church and he had never had authority to hold his position in the church. In a bizarre side line to the case a reporter who snapped a picture of the note from across the court was prosecuted for the action.</p>
<p>Back to what puzzles me. I contacted the Arizona prosecuting investigator about the details of the FBI action. He could not explain it. He had asked his superiors about that and there is no clue to how he got on the Ten Most Wanted list or who put up the two rewards. Let us try to connect the dots. In June, 2006, Mitt had announced his intention to run for POTUS. So, had John McCain. Mark Shurtleff, Utah Attorney General and Terry Goddard, Arizona Attorney General had joined hands taking years in the making to create a policy to avoid incidents along polygamy lines that would compare with the mistakes made in 1953. Utah supported Mitt Romney by 90% and Mark Shurtleff, AG of Utah, supported McCain. Any press releases by Mitt Romney were matched by press releases regarding Jeffs, even when there was no event. Google activity for Mitt Romney listed Provo, UT, Boise, ID and Malmo, Sweden as the three highest request areas. Utah successfully convicted Jeffs (on appeal) but did not inform the jury that the main witness (victim) had a $10 million dollar lawsuit against the FLDS trust. Arizona has taken custody of Jeffs and has not been able to get cooperation from their key witnesses and have dropped those cases.</p>
<p>The publicity cow has almost run dry and there is no more news about Jeffs. But, wait!  A sheriff in El Dorado, Texas has taken over 200 prisoners in an FLDS compound. The first children were bussed away from the compound in Baptist Sunday School busses. A judge issued a warrant to cross the Holy of Holy threshold of an FLDS temple in search for a 16 year old girl who placed a 911 call accusing a 50 year old man under probation in Arizona of marrying and impregnating her. The man has been contacted and says he does not know the girl. Yes, and 200 people have been arrested in Texas. For a while this situation seemed like it would rival the Waco debacle, but the FLDS in El Dorado do not seem to be suicidal or heavily armed, in fact they are probably having a picnic being martyrs and having their civil rights trampled on. El Dorado will not be Waco, but it will be the next publicity cow to replace Jeffs in Purgatory Prison.</p>
<p>Meanwhile there are a bunch of “social conservatives” trying to ruin the good name of<br />
Mitt Romney and not caring where exactly the money came from. Considering that McCain will suffer collateral damage, it is most likely from the liberal left. What Republican can profit from such a dumb move? Certainly Mike Huckabee is not involved.</p>
<p>So, where is the Pulitzer Prize  winning Washington Post when we need some investigative reporting? (Whisper): Follow the money.</p>
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		<title>By: HaroldHutchison</title>
		<link>http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/comment-page-1/#comment-12507</link>
		<dc:creator>HaroldHutchison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:43:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/#comment-12507</guid>
		<description>CarlH - My response is simple:
Who do I believe, Mr. Murray, or the statements from signatories that I have read with my own eyes?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CarlH &#8211; My response is simple:<br />
Who do I believe, Mr. Murray, or the statements from signatories that I have read with my own eyes?</p>
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		<title>By: CarlH</title>
		<link>http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/comment-page-1/#comment-12506</link>
		<dc:creator>CarlH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 17:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/#comment-12506</guid>
		<description>Someone over at &quot;Government Is Not God PAC&quot; needs a quick lesson on the first law of holes!  It just gets worse:  &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.govnotgod.org/www2/index.php?option=com_content&amp;task=view&amp;id=54&amp;Itemid=53&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The NO Mitt Ad And Mormonism&lt;/a&gt;

Is it just my Mormon thin skin or is this variations on the &quot;Some of my best friends are Mormon--well, at least one of them anyway&quot;?  

The irony of William Murray decrying Mormon &quot;dishonesty&quot; in defense of his groups over-the-top disingenuous mischaracterization of Romney&#039;s record is just too rich!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone over at &#8220;Government Is Not God PAC&#8221; needs a quick lesson on the first law of holes!  It just gets worse:  <a href="http://www.govnotgod.org/www2/index.php?option=com_content&amp;task=view&amp;id=54&amp;Itemid=53" rel="nofollow">The NO Mitt Ad And Mormonism</a></p>
<p>Is it just my Mormon thin skin or is this variations on the &#8220;Some of my best friends are Mormon&#8211;well, at least one of them anyway&#8221;?  </p>
<p>The irony of William Murray decrying Mormon &#8220;dishonesty&#8221; in defense of his groups over-the-top disingenuous mischaracterization of Romney&#8217;s record is just too rich!</p>
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		<title>By: HaroldHutchison</title>
		<link>http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/comment-page-1/#comment-12505</link>
		<dc:creator>HaroldHutchison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 16:06:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/#comment-12505</guid>
		<description>Looks like they are trying to hang a &quot;Mormons Need Not Apply&quot; sign on the Republican presidential and vice-presidential nominations.

At this point, there is no other possible conclusion that I can draw, particularly given the past comments of a number of these signers. As such,it is forcing me to re-evaluate whether I can trust the religious right, or if it isn&#039;t time for the GOP to come up with a new coalition that will leave them on the outside looking in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Looks like they are trying to hang a &#8220;Mormons Need Not Apply&#8221; sign on the Republican presidential and vice-presidential nominations.</p>
<p>At this point, there is no other possible conclusion that I can draw, particularly given the past comments of a number of these signers. As such,it is forcing me to re-evaluate whether I can trust the religious right, or if it isn&#8217;t time for the GOP to come up with a new coalition that will leave them on the outside looking in.</p>
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		<title>By: conservativeinbama</title>
		<link>http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/comment-page-1/#comment-12504</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativeinbama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 14:57:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.article6blog.com/2008/04/07/they-are-back-and-it-is-ugly/#comment-12504</guid>
		<description>I believe the real reason why they all support Huckabee is not just because of him being the Anti Romney or the Baptist Preacher, but because of his &quot;Abolish the IRS&quot; shtick. If the IRS is abolished then that would mean the end of the 501-C-(3) provisions which prevent the &quot;politicking at the pulpit&quot;, something several of his supporters straddled a fine line to do this election year. 

Getting rid of that provision would allow for what I think would be a hijacking of the GOP and reforming it into a Christian Democratic Union. The Democrats would finally gain a permanent majority in all Three branches of government should that ever happen.

I do hope that if Sen. McCain wins in Nov. it will be without the support of these Extreme social conservatives. It is one thing to be supportive of Soc. Con. issues but it is ridiculous when Presidential candidates have to give speeches outlining their religious beliefs just to appease these people.

The Constitution does Not allow for a religious litmus test they certainly applied.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe the real reason why they all support Huckabee is not just because of him being the Anti Romney or the Baptist Preacher, but because of his &#8220;Abolish the IRS&#8221; shtick. If the IRS is abolished then that would mean the end of the 501-C-(3) provisions which prevent the &#8220;politicking at the pulpit&#8221;, something several of his supporters straddled a fine line to do this election year. </p>
<p>Getting rid of that provision would allow for what I think would be a hijacking of the GOP and reforming it into a Christian Democratic Union. The Democrats would finally gain a permanent majority in all Three branches of government should that ever happen.</p>
<p>I do hope that if Sen. McCain wins in Nov. it will be without the support of these Extreme social conservatives. It is one thing to be supportive of Soc. Con. issues but it is ridiculous when Presidential candidates have to give speeches outlining their religious beliefs just to appease these people.</p>
<p>The Constitution does Not allow for a religious litmus test they certainly applied.</p>
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