Super Tuesday Preview: Believe it Or Not, The Religious Question Looms Large, Huckabee Hangs On, And More
Post-Mortems?
Lowell picked up on an MSNBC post Friday that started doing “post-mortems” on Romney. Now, I reject the idea that this is over. As HH said Saturday, things move too fast in this cycle for a death certificate just yet. But that same pull quote caused a brief discussion over at The Corner:
Noted McCain guy Ramesh makes the arguable point:
But if Romney had been an Episcopalian with a record of flip-flops many evangelicals would probably still have gone with Huckabee, a fellow evangelical who has a consistent record on the social issues and is at ease talking about them. Let’s not leap to uncharitable assumptions.
But Ramesh, there are studies out showing that “flip-flop” is, in many instances, code for “Mormon.” Your point had weight prior to that study being released, but now it is impossible to tell when people say “flop-flop” if they mean “flip-flop”, or something less charitable.
Lowell: A pundit of Ramesh’s sophistication should know better. Romney has changed his public positions on certain issues. Some people call that “flip-flopping,” others call it an evolution of views. It comes down to whether you believe Romney or not. He has a record as governor that is consistent with his evolved views. But no one looks at the record. That’s where the “Mormons lie” meme comes into play. No, Ramesh, we’re not talking about an uncharitable assumption, it’s a phenomenon documented by scholarly opinion research.
Wishful Thinking . . .
Weeks after Mitt Romney tried to put questions about his Mormon faith to rest with his landmark “Faith in America” speech, the spotlight switched again Saturday from the GOP presidential candidate’s real-world credentials to his religious beliefs as he and family members attended the funeral of Mormon leader Gordon B. Hinckley.
Uh, guys? - If that is truly the case how come the coverage was limited to about 2 wire service stories and a couple of MSM campaign blog posts?
By the way, Romney and Hinckley were personally acquainted. A fact that is even more true for some of Romney’s family. This was no religious observance - this was paying respects, simple as that.
If Huck Goes?…
Reuters wonders where Evangelicals will go if Huckabee gets out. Give me a break - Huck isn’t getting out until he can do as much damage as possible. I remain puzzled by the man’s motivations. Whatever they are, they cannot be service to his party or the wings of the party he claims to represent. Review Rudy’s withdrawal and endorsement of McCain for lessons in how Huck should be playing things.
Religious Polling
Religion and Ethics Newsweekly looks at some of the latest data. They call the Mormon data mixed. You know that “code” thing has a way of messing with poll results.
But The Real Enemy Remains the Left
This rant from Reason magazine is one of the uglier things I have read in quite a while now.
The problem with Mitt Romney is that he isn’t Mormon enough. His unusual, unpopular religion is the one part of his public image that doesn’t feel like it came out of a focus group.
[…]
Will Mitt’s Mormon roots shine through someday? Will he suddenly spew something wonderfully strange? (I don’t count his revelation that L. Ron Hubbard’s Battlefield Earth is his favorite novel, though his choice does suggest he’s ecumenical about those “brands of faith.”) Maybe he’ll start to talk about exaltation, my favorite element of Mormon theology. With enough work, the doctrine says, the faithful shall “be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them.”
Huey Long gave us the greatest campaign slogan in American history: Every Man a King. Romney could one-up him by crying Every Man a God. Instead he promises “true strength for America’s future,” which isn’t incompatible with godhood but sure sounds a lot duller.
Frankly, I don’t know what is worse in the piece, the hateful and vile treatment Romney’s faith is given, or the complete cynicism and desire for sensationalism that underlies the criticism. If this is truly indicative of the Left’s desires for our nation, we HAVE to end the silliness tomorrow. Remember, McCain wants to get along with these people.
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9 Responses to “Super Tuesday Preview: Believe it Or Not, The Religious Question Looms Large, Huckabee Hangs On, And More”
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coltakashi on 04 Feb 2008 at 10:34 am #
The fact that Senator McCain wants to get along with the people on the Left who are blatantly anti-Mormon should not be surprising, since he gets along with his own Mom, who is blatantly anti-Mormon.
4thnephite on 04 Feb 2008 at 1:31 pm #
I was listening to Rush Limbaugh today, nice to know Mitt is a true Republican. One delegate was told to compromise his principles and join McCain, in which he answered he quit. Which means to me and others conservatives are tired of compromising our principals to get along with the left.
This blog is full of people who are tired of compromising what they know to be true, we will not go along to get along.
The other day Maria Shriver endorse Obama, looks like a good grudge match between McCain and Obama, I pray they take their misgivings outside.
I find those who cannot or will not understand history will repeat it.
If Clinton took care of his job in the White House the twin towers would still be there, period.
The media wants to talk about the economy, McCain has said he does not care about the economy but keeping us safe from terrorism. What is the difference. For some odd reason the politicians who have sided with McCain are all sounding like the Democrats. I pray we can rescue the party of Lincoln and restore the God given values so many people hold dear.
God Bless America, Joe
mamabaig on 04 Feb 2008 at 11:45 pm #
I am not usually a politically involved person. But I am trying to get involved this election and decide on a candidate. I am LDS. I am also a fourth generation American of Mexican descent. We have seven children. My husband is self-employed and we can’t afford insurance. A friend sent me a link to a mass resistance.org report outlining Romney’s positions on issues like abortion and gay rights as Governor.
It seemed pretty damning of Mitt to me. I came here, by way of suggestion from still another friend who supports Romney, but I am not finding anything to combat the accusations on massresistance.org. Saying that those who accuse Mitt of “flip-flopping” are merely Mormon haters doesn’t cut it for me. I have been appalled that Romney is taking such an unmerciful stance against “illegal aliens.” How does he and others propose to get rid of all these undocumented people? How will they differentiate between who is here illegally, and who was born here? I would think, being part of a world-wide church, that he would have more compassion on his Hispanic brothers and sisters. Immigration needs reform, but you just can’t round up people who have made a life here (while Americans profited from them being here and turned a blind eye to it) and just decide to send them home when you decide it is not in your best interest anymore. Kind of like Romney did to his OWN personal undocumented workers at Christmas time. He didn’t care if they weren’t undocumented until it behooved him to care.
I know people who were brought here as children, are illegal, yet speak nothing but English, know no other way of life than America and would love to become a citizen. Some of these people have earned degrees, yet can’t get a drivers license. They are stuck in between. Who would have such people return to a “homeland” that is foriegn to them? That is inhumane!
I have been unhappy with the negative ads he ran against McCain. A Saint should behave better than that I thought. He made me ashamed to be called a fellow Saint. I could not support a candidate who wants to mandate health insurance and fine or garnish the wages of those who can’t afford it.
Romney as president is kind of scary from my point of view. I hoped for more out of an LDS candidate.
I would like to see evidence to the contrary of his support of abortion, & gay marriage. You say that his beliefs have “evolved.” I can understand that somewhat. In my life some of my beliefs have changed overtime. But supporting abortion and gay rights is pretty extreme.
I would like to know why Romney as president is not a threat to people like me.
jane on 05 Feb 2008 at 2:39 am #
Dear Mamabaig, and others on here. — I too am LDS, and before the beginning of this election run, I had been VERY upset that Romney had was supporting pro choice. I couldn’t understand it! I thought IF he had the teachings of the church and believed them, then HOW COULD HE think that. Then when the run began, I did some research and got to hear him in his own WORDS explain what happened to him. I now understand it was because of a death from botched abortion in the family of his mother, and he thought the principle of CHOICE so she could get prof. medical care was at stake. He was only looking at HER choices being limited. Though HE was PERSONALLY totally AGAINST ABORTION, he thought each should GET to make that choice. Yet, when he was faced with signing on an issue that would DENY the choice of an unborn baby, he realized that there were TWO choices here! Pro Life would allow two people to go on living with choices but the FALSE NAMED “Pro Choice” would not only deny but KILL a living human beings WHOLE life of choices! So, he realized he couldn’t stay effectively pro choice. He ALWAYS came down PRO LIFE ever since! He HIMSELF immediately told his constituents, by paying for a full page add, and explaining what had happened and why. — He said he now understood he was wrong and is NOW — PRO LIFE. I TOTALLY believe him! I like that he can admit mistakes, and repent!
On gay marriage, ROMNEY was NEVER FOR IT!!— I understand that he had hoped that by letting the gays have “civil unions” where they could have some protection if things went bad in their relations, they could get fair treatment. He HOPED that would satisfy them and they would not demand marriage, which he ALWAYS felt should be kept to between a man and a woman!
I wish he had realized that anytime you try to bargain with anyone following evil principles, it is going to be like “what is mine is mine and what is YOURS in negotiable”– they will NEVER be satisfied unless they take all yours too! It is Satan’s plan, if he can’t win, then he will take down everyone with him that he can! — Again, though I wish Romney had seen this coming, HE DID LEARN! He has NEVER been for gay marriage! He worked HARD to defeat it in his state when he was Gov. but couldn’t stop it! He is FOR an amendment to the constitution to prohibit it!
I think that nobody is perfect, but how we GET better is WHEN we make mistakes, to realize it, feel sorry, acknowledge and appoligise it to those involved (including God) work to fix it, then NEVER make the same mistake again! He DOES THIS. I can think of some who don’t! I WANT a pres. who acknowledges mistakes, as THEN I can trust that person! — I have totally supported Romney since I got the FULL PICTURE on these issues, and as I saw his other stands on other issues. He is the BEST choice for America!
I check this site out everyday, because I am SO HAPPY to see that there are MANY Evangelicals who think for themselves and are willing to stand up- even against their peers for what they believe is right! May God bless us all to always do that, and elect the BEST we can!
jane on 05 Feb 2008 at 3:47 am #
On the Illegal immigrants issue. It seems that the LDS Article of Faith # 12 that “We believe in being subject to kings presidents magistrates and in honoring obeying and sustaining the law.” is not being applied here by this sister.
Any who have broken the laws (like to come into any country illegally), should expect to get the consequences from those actions. The logical consequence is that they must leave, and it should be at THEIR own cost, and as soon as possible, with not costing those here legally anything MORE to have to find and deport them.
Yes, it logical that it should hurt to get the consequences of a wrong choice, and that is best for our learning too. If we were rewarded forever for wrong choices, then they wouldn’t effectively BE wrong choices, and more would choose wrong.
Stealing is stealing, whether of a candy bar or of thousands of dollars, or of a country, if it is NOT yours, and you take it without the permission of those whose it is, and/or with deception, it is dishonest and stealing! Repentance is needed!
I wouldn’t want my children using ANY thing I even suspected wasn’t gotten legally! I would rather rather live in poverty that dishonesty! And I have known poverty. As a child we were so poor that I slept with only an old army blanket for warmth, and we lived in a quonset hut. Once all we had to eat was canned stewed tomatoes, (there were 5 kids under five and 2 parents) and I still remember the bags of food that were later brought to us by the church when the visiting teachers discovered our plight.
Poverty will not prevent us from being able to hold our heads up to to greet the Savior Jesus Christ, but dishonesty will! Slipping in our honesty ANY, is a slippery slope to more and more and rationalization that it isn’t wrong. It will even corrupt the children! Honesty is a temple recommend requirement!
Now, when the presence of a whole family is illegal, (even if it was the grandparents that made the wrong choice) IF the parents obey the principles of the gospel to be honest in ALL their dealings, they will take their family and leave. Of course they will ALL have a very hard adjustment, but it is the fault of the adults who made the dishonest choice! It will HURT, but I would certainly hope and pray that if ANY of the illegals here are LDS (I pray NOT! — as they denied the faith to come!!) that they will repent and CONFESS their wrong and make it right!!! LEAVE, and get in line with the rest sooner!
There will be some things that will help them to return; any education, good experiences, friends here and English language, as these can’t BE returned. But the MOST important place we all should seek to go/return to is to live with our Heavenly Father after this life and to do that we MUST REPENT of ANY wrongs!
I am VERY sorry that EVERYONE can’t live in the USA. Our scriptures say it is a choice land above all others, and that God helped in founding our laws etc. Wouldn’t it be great if people would work to get their OWN countries laws as good as ours, rather than to BREAK our countries laws, by illegally coming to enjoy the privileges that the laws provide? Charity & HONESTY start at home. It is a corrupt principle that the end justifies the means. It will NEVER work to do wrong and expect a good result. Consequences are what HELP us choose the right, until we LOVE the right enough to choose it for its sake alone. That is the path the Savior showed us to follow. Lets do right!
jane on 05 Feb 2008 at 4:08 am #
On the “negative/attack” adds. We are SUPPOSED to compare candidates on their records on the issues. If ANY consider bringing up records to be wrong, then what ARE we to compare on? It is only logical to do that and the Bible says, “By their fruits ye shall know them.”
If however the candidate has ADMITTED he was wrong, (like Romney on his position in YEARS PAST on abortion (– did you see how YOUNG he looks in the videos when he was effectively pro choice??) and ever since he has not made that mistake again! There has been plenty of time to SEE the change of heart from his later choices. We should NOT bring up that PAST/CORRECTED mistake as a negative. Maybe it should be a POSITIVE, that the candidate CAN learn and be truthful about when he was wrong? Romney was given an award for his PRO LIFE ACTIONS when he was gov.!
I think it is ironic that any would consider showing/comparing their records (that they have NOT repented of!) as an attack? They should consider it free press, as those FOR their stands would then LIKE them! If those are NOT their stands then why haven’t they denounced the stand and their record?? They just CLAIM that they are conservative and hope people will not check the records that they claim they stand on!
Did you hear that lady on the news (it was either Fox or CNN), who is — I think it was a coalition for the family worker– that said Romney was helping them and worked with them, but McCain not only didn’t help– he voted against the amendment!
Oh, I pray that people will come to a knowledge of the truth, and will elect the best choice, chance we have, Romney! –
jane on 05 Feb 2008 at 4:24 am #
About the charge that Romney employed illegal immigrants.
Romney had a COMPANY to do his lawn care on one of their properties. He did NOT know that they had any illegals working for them! When he was told that they did, his family told the COMPANY that if they didn’t correct that, that they would have to get a different company. The company did NOT obey the law, and so they were taken off the job.
Are we supposed to go out and ask the roofer or the house painter to show us their papers?? That is against the law! It is the COMPANY that is supposed to check on that!
It is a TOTAL DISTORTION to blame Romney for this!!!!!!!!
jane on 05 Feb 2008 at 4:39 am #
“How does he and others propose to get rid of all these undocumented people? How will they differentiate between who is here illegally, and who was born here?”
I heard Romney say on the last debate what he proposed, and it was VERY humane. In my memory it went like this; that those who had just come should just leave, NOW. If others had been here longer, they should be given an appropriate amount of time to sell their homes etc and then leave. If school children ore in the mix, they should be allowed to finish the school year, then leave as soon as it is done.
I didn’t hear anything about how they will differentiate. That is a good question, but can be dealt with. Maybe like when they do the next census, to ask to see the birth certificates?
Maybe another incentive, is that if you leave on your own, you get to keep the things/money of what you earned here, but it you try to STAY illegally, and are caught, then ALL YOU HAVE IS FORFEIT!! — It will be sold to pay for those who had to be paid to find you and to pay for your exit travel costs etc.
There may be some that had grandparents that came illegally and even lied to their children about it, so the family does NOT know they are here illegally. Maybe it would be good for any who may be in doubt, to check it out throughly??
I think ANY good that illegals MAY have done, to work in jobs that supposedly Americans don’t want, is LOST in comparison to what is lost from their use of the USA without paying income taxes or using hospital emergency rooms, and costing more for their education, and making housing tighter, and if they default on loans etc.
I also understand that while the adults who come illegally are USUALLY very careful not to break the law, and then be identified, that their children (born here or not) feel defiant and are in a MAJORITY of those breaking the laws! NOT good!
I think if the govt would NOT support people who COULD work, by giving them welfare, instead of helping them find work and then requiring them to DO ANY honest work, then there would not BE any jobs that Americans wouldn’t do! If they got hungry, then they would work! Logical consequences.
It think it is the liberals that are mostly to blame for this sad dole that encourages the idleness that leads to worse things!
jane on 05 Feb 2008 at 5:00 am #
“I would think, being part of a world-wide church, that he would have more compassion on his Hispanic brothers and sisters.”
The LDS church has compassion on everyone, especially those who have done wrong. But like the Savior who said to the woman caught in adultery that they wanted him to say to obey the law of Moses to stone her. Jesus didn’t condemn her to death. He gave her a chance to repent. He said, “… go and sin no more.” He didn’t say “continue to live in sin, which continuing to live illegal/dishonest is!” He said “go!”
The principle is that LDS believe in “obeying, honoring and sustaining the law”. If something is wrong/illegal you don’t do it. If you think the earthly law is wrong, then you work to change it, legally. Yet, you can’t change Gods’ laws.
Don’t expect to be an exception to consequences of wrong!
Even like with people who may feel they are/would be discriminated against by the church because they are gay. The church stand I believe is that any sexual relations outside of legal and lawful marriage is adultery. They are NO harder on gays than on heterosexuals. Pre-marital sex ALSO falls in this area of adultery. Its a sin!
Also, if you are fighting gay FEELINGS so you do NOT act on/with your gay feelings but work to be rid of them, then I understand that you can still get a temple recommend. Also, that there is other counseling etc that the church will help the person with. There are some who have been HEALED of this affliction, though the gay community does NOT want this to be known, as they want the world to think it is like in the blood!